Pastrami

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Pastrami

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jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28233
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 23 7:18 am Post subject: Pastrami

Some quite good pastrami cooked yesterday.

A kilo of beef joint.

for the brine:
1 litre water
Curing salt according to packet instructions.
lots of flavourings allspice, onion powder, coriander, garlic powder, black pepper, bay leafs, cloves, cinnamon , brown sugar.
Plus of course liquid smoke.
boiled and cooled.

lots of brine injection (actually not quite enough, the cure missed about 5%)

Left in fridge for about 40 hours.

This time steamed in an instant pot on low steam, monitored by a meat probe. It was turned off when temperature hit 70c and continued to rise to 83, when it dipped to 75c I gave it another burst until the temperature started upwards again then turned off.
We then wandered out for a beach walk, on return it had dipped below 70c, 70c being the point where things start to melt down and had over 5 hours in the steamer.

Really quite a good result. Next time it might be a bit more salt and one more night in the brine.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46207
Location: yes

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 23 1:08 pm Post subject:

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15966

Posted: Tue Oct 03, 23 7:06 am Post subject:
You could of course try real smoke. Clean sawdust isn't too difficult to get hold of. Just have to know what it comes from.

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28233
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 23 6:05 am Post subject:

Mistress Rose wrote:

You could of course try real smoke. Clean sawdust isn't too difficult to get hold of. Just have to know what it comes from.

I do sometimes use real smoke in one of those spiral contraptions, but real smoke has drawbacks including increased carcinogens.
So I am playing with liquid a bit.
I have another chunk of beef bring now and whilst it might be sacrilegious I'm planning on buying some salmon today. I have never done smoked salmon with liquid smoke before and I'm curious.

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15966

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 23 8:29 am Post subject:
Does liquid smoke not contain carcinogens? I would have thought to get the taste it would have to. The curing salt will also probably contain sodium nitrate or nitrite, which has been considered unhealthy.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46207
Location: yes

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 23 9:28 am Post subject:

done lots of salmon

dry cure, salt sweet(dill and spices optional)
damp cure, add a bit of whisky to the above

hot or cold smoke, oak, fruitwood or for a different twist the more fragrant pines are interesting in a retsina sort of way

home made in a bucket with smoke in a bottle, is that not pretty much the same as the low-end commercial stuff?

a bbq with a lid, or scrapheap challenge, or basic bushcraft will provide a smoker
adjust fuel and air etc for the style you want

usually better than the top end commercial stuff

biggest criteria is fresh fish, salted before rigor is best, just after is ok
many days later on ice is not so good
fresh salted and frozen until required seems to work for hot smoked

ps "curing salt" is not something i ever use, sea salt and preferably superb sea salt works fine
many recipes use too much salt

chose a sweet you like, honey is pretty good with salmon, light cane sugar is better for herring
again do not use too much

depending on the size of fish/lumps dry cure 24 hrs to a week in a cold place(under 5C but frozen and cure while defrosting is fine)

exclude air from the curing fish, a vac packer is ideal for smallish amounts but a lid on a barrel of herring will work if you pack them tight

thinking of herring, the only wet cure fish i do is pickled herring, but that is rather different to wet cure for fake smoking

for a couple of salmon steaks, rub them with salt sweet spice, cure them a while
hot wok with rack and lid, spoonful of tea leaves, put fish on rack, pop lid on
hot smoked when it stops smoking(usually 5 to ten mins)

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28233
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Fri Oct 06, 23 6:26 am Post subject:

Frustrating progress yesterday, the meater seemed to have more range problems than ever causing me to miss the temperature curve

Still a decent result, but I'm aiming for science.

Then I did what I should have done all along and googled and the meter now has an API

Started programming the API successfully

But noticed things are connecting to the probe but not the charging unit which would explain range issues.

All a bit weird and coincidental, but I think on balance it broke before I used the API.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46207
Location: yes

Posted: Fri Oct 06, 23 7:27 am Post subject:

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28233
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Fri Oct 06, 23 7:40 am Post subject:

Essentially the API means I can write code to see the ambient temperature and internal temperature of the meat.
I can use a plain on electric hob then with a smart plug and control exactly what happens.
e.g. get the steaming temp to say 90c.
Turn off both at that point and when the internal temperature hits say 67c.
Over time I should be able to iterate to the meat staying at a relatively stable 70c.
I have found a support submission page for the meater probe, but before hitting that I'm seeing if the probe still charges from the base unit.

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15966

Posted: Fri Oct 06, 23 8:13 am Post subject:
An easier way is a thermostat on a water bath.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46207
Location: yes

Posted: Fri Oct 06, 23 8:15 am Post subject:
technopan silly me, carry on my 7/8 wolf was good at knowing when it was cooked, if it was it too fast or too slow and when keep it simple and raw (i will not mention his "green bone" delicacies) a wolf is easier to train than control gear and far more adaptable as a cooking monitor

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28233
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Oct 08, 23 6:50 am Post subject:
The "smoked" salmon was a good result albeit wetter than the proper stuff. A basic over night dry brine, just kosher sort and some bay leaves. Then a wash a dry leaving for a few hours followed by a wet brine for 4 hours with liquid smoke. Next time I might just dilute and brush on the smoke. This won't replace doing things right but it's not half bad.

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15966

Posted: Mon Oct 09, 23 7:46 am Post subject:
What is the difference between kosher salt, and sea salt?

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28233
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Mon Oct 09, 23 11:04 am Post subject:

I'm possibly not using it in the right context and I'm not sure what it was called when I bought the sack many years ago.
But basically I'm talking big coloured granules.

My next experiment is just cooled down from the air fryer and was a few chicken breasts in a curing salt brine with garlic and liquid smoke brined for three nights without any injection of brine.

So very simple if not quick and very tasty.

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