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dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46249
Location: yes

Posted: Sun Jul 03, 16 11:10 pm Post subject:
i plant by chucking seeds roughly where i want trees a bit later,seems to work fine. it might be worth flailing the brambles a few times and maybe even plough em first

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16004

Posted: Mon Jul 04, 16 6:47 am Post subject:
Please don't send ash seedlings or cuttings around at the moment. If they have chelara, it could spread it. As far as I know, seeds are safe. Nice idea to establish some hazel and possibly ash coppice Tavascarow.

Tavascarow

Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 8407
Location: South Cornwall

Posted: Mon Jul 04, 16 8:28 am Post subject:

wellington womble wrote:

I've got about 3/4 of an acre I'd like to plant up with trees. Heavy-ish soil and a bit shady in places. Currently under about 8 foot of brambles. There's a huge ash, a big sycamore (and a couple of smaller ones) and some hoarse chestnuts, as well as some hazel coppice and a couple of lovely oaks already on site (They all have TPOs on, or I'd have the sycamores out for firewood). Initially I wanted ash for coppicing, but as I can't get hold of it, I was going to go for hazel coppice with oak standards. But if I can get some ash in, I'd like to try.

The woodland Trust have mixed tree packs including guards & stakes at reasonable prices & grant aid for larger plantings & community projects.

Tavascarow

Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 8407
Location: South Cornwall

Posted: Mon Jul 04, 16 8:33 am Post subject:

Mistress Rose wrote:

Please don't send ash seedlings or cuttings around at the moment. If they have chelara, it could spread it. As far as I know, seeds are safe. Nice idea to establish some hazel and possibly ash coppice Tavascarow.

Valid point Mistress Rose. I'm saving from local seedlings.
Planting from stock already adapted to the local environment but with the genetic variance seed gives will hopefully ensure some survive if chelera gets a hold.
Although I'm hoping it's not going to be as bad as some have predicted.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46249
Location: yes

Posted: Mon Jul 04, 16 9:21 am Post subject:
afaik seeds are safe, bits and seedlings from somewhere else might be bad.

wellington womble

Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 15051
Location: East Midlands

Posted: Mon Jul 04, 16 10:38 am Post subject:

Mistress Rose wrote:

Good point (it being precisely why I can't buy the things in the first place!)

We are in the national forest, and there is a scheme where I can basically have a small wood planted FOC. I beleive they may even clear the land, but they did say I need to get rid of the abandoned vehicles first! I will probably flail and plough though. It's so delightfully easy with the kubota. At least, it is when the stuff is out of the way. Trying to remember where exactly the old wardrobe, pig house and pile of biodegrading pallets are is a bit taxing!

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16004

Posted: Tue Jul 05, 16 6:50 am Post subject:

Glad you have all agreed with me. The best thing to do is to get seed from as many local healthy trees as you can. With any luck some of them will be resistant. As you say, Tavascarow, local stock will be the best suited to your area. Ideally, let the see germinate where it wants as self sown seed is likely to grow in the best place for itself. I know this isn't really practical in a lot of cases, but will produce the strongest, if not best shaped and placed trees.

Another thing that the FC are suggesting is to have as open a wood as possible. That way the wind will blow through and there is less risk of a build up of spores.

Ty Gwyn

Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 4613
Location: Lampeter

Posted: Tue Jul 05, 16 7:34 am Post subject:

Mistress Rose wrote:

Another thing that the FC are suggesting is to have as open a wood as possible. That way the wind will blow through and there is less risk of a build up of spores.

Does that mean the end of conifer plantations as we know them?

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16004

Posted: Wed Jul 06, 16 6:41 am Post subject:
No, just for ash. It makes no difference for other trees. There is a lot less money for planting conifers now though, and with leaving the EU even the grant money available may dry up completely as that is where it came from.

Ty Gwyn

Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 4613
Location: Lampeter

Posted: Wed Jul 06, 16 7:46 am Post subject:
You say it makes no difference to other tree`s, A few year`s back they were felling and burning certain conifers to stop the spread of the spores because of a certain disease.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Wed Jul 06, 16 6:56 pm Post subject:

Mistress Rose wrote:

No, just for ash. It makes no difference for other trees. There is a lot less money for planting conifers now though, and with leaving the EU even the grant money available may dry up completely as that is where it came from.

The money comes from the UK, perhaps via the EU but that's via the UK in the first place. So, if the UK voters want more woodland grants they can vote for them and we'll cut out the middle men.

I wonder if the FC have updated their own rules with regard to ash spacing, they've been rather intransigent in the past when it comes to spacing, not wanting to let common sense get in the way of the rules.

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16004

Posted: Thu Jul 07, 16 7:39 am Post subject:

If you plant trees too far apart they don't develop straight stems, so ideally something like 2m spacing. With ash it is an advantage to thin early anyway, so get better spacing. You may be thinking of phytophra in larch Ty Gwyn; that is also carried as spores.

The money for grants comes from the EU but is paid out by the UK, Treacodactyl. Of course the UK could decide to continue to pay the grants, but somehow I can't see it happening as I don't think most politicians would know a tree if it came up and hit them. No doubt we will be told to be 'more efficient'. As grants have been contracted for up to the next 5 years I am wondering if we will contiue to get them or if the government will break the contract.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Thu Jul 07, 16 8:55 am Post subject:

Mistress Rose wrote:

The money for grants comes from the EU but is paid out by the UK, Treacodactyl.

As I said, the UK pays the money in in the first place. Funny though, when the money for various woodland grants dried up a year or two ago it was the fault of the current government.

As for grants continuing, you may wish to blame the politicians but it's likely to be down to public opinion. Those on the left seem to generally hate the idea of land owners getting grants.

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16004

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 16 7:12 am Post subject:
The current grants can be paid either to the land owner of the person working the land if they have security of tenure for the life of the crop. Admittedly a bit tricky with oak plantation, but not unreasonable with hazel coppice being cut every 7 years. Means the person getting the grant has to have the right to cut next rotation.

HenX

Joined: 27 Apr 2009
Posts: 1459
Location: Forest of Dean

Posted: Sat Jul 23, 16 6:29 pm Post subject:
I'm continually removing the dratted things, so feel free to call in here at some stage and collect some.

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