polytunnels & the council

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polytunnels & the council
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Melli-Jane

Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 272
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 12 1:00 pm Post subject: polytunnels & the council

I have just purchased a nice little polytunnel (15' x 10') which is plenty big enough for me to start growing some peppers, tomatoes, aubergines etc. Having just had the necessary chat with Wealden council, I need planning permission to put it up, grrr. Apparently I could put it in my garden no problems but need permission and a full application to put it up at the smallholding (6 acres) - and I have to go through the same process that I went through for my 650m2 barn! bonkers

.
I'm not sure how I will fix it to the ground as it may well get moved next year as we work out whether to keep our veg patch where it is or follow the pigs as they cultivate the ground. Can I get round the planning if it is temporary or not permanently fixed to the ground, or would you just say sod it, and put the application in for a larger structure so that I could extend in the future?
So perhaps put it up on a temp basis this year (with planning it'll snow before we get it up) and then apply?
I'm a polytunnel newbie so am unsure.

Bebo

Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12590
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 12 1:44 pm Post subject:

Bung it up and don't tell anyone. If someone complains or the council notices it and that you don't have consent, you'll get an enforcement notice to take it down. You can always then apply for retrospective planning consent at that time. I wouldn't suggest this for anything other than a polytunnel, but as its not going to be a big or costly exercise to take it down you aren't risking much if they ask you to.

Frazzled_Barbie

Joined: 26 Sep 2011
Posts: 466
Location: Buckinghamshire

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 12 2:14 pm Post subject:

Bebo wrote:

Ditto to the above - I have a poly tunnel and needed planning for anything over 8 x 6 in the garden.

Erected the thing in a part of the garden hard to see from the road etc and have had it 3 years now. So far so good and no nosey planning official has called so far.

Planning is an ass.... if I want I can erect as many 8 x 6 sheds in my garden as I want. Fill the blooming place if I want. But If I want to erect a shed that is slightly larger than that I have to get planning. Bonkers! Sorry end of rant.

12Bore

Joined: 15 Jun 2008
Posts: 9089
Location: Paddling in the Mersey

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 12 2:33 pm Post subject:
As above, TBH I wouldn't have asked...

Sally Too

Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 2511
Location: N.Ireland

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 12 2:46 pm Post subject:
Easier to seek forgiveness than permission..... Ours has no pp and is in an area of garden that used to be field.

Melli-Jane

Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 272
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 12 4:13 pm Post subject:
ummm... perhaps will put it up on a temporary basis and see what happens... cheers x

Nature'sgrafter

Joined: 22 Feb 2012
Posts: 527
Location: Sanday , Orkney

Posted: Mon Apr 02, 12 10:18 pm Post subject:

Ask them from what building regulations section they are referencing their information as regards the poly tunnel needing planing permission. Then ask them to send you in righting exactly what construction specifications you were expected to comply to when building the tunnel I.E distance from boundary's other buildings, foundation depths, materials, methods of fixings structural loads required to withstand etc. then if you do just build it and someone complains, and you apply for retrospective permission you already know it is within the rules and they shouldn't have any grounds to refuse.

Bebo

Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12590
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 5:37 am Post subject:

Nature'sgrafter wrote:

Ask them from what building regulations section they are referencing their information as regards the poly tunnel needing planing permission.

Planning consent is completely unrelated to building regulations. It'll be under the planning act somewhere, a document which is open to wide interpretation.

Lorrainelovesplants

Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 6521
Location: Dordogne

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 5:38 am Post subject:
Just put it up and tell no-one.

foggy

Joined: 21 Feb 2012
Posts: 343
Location: Devon

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 6:21 am Post subject:
Happens all the time. A farmer round here put up a huge storage barn, but got dobbed in about 6 months later by someone who only just realised it was in their view. As the farmer knew everyone on the parish council it still got the ok!

welsh veg grower

Joined: 23 Jan 2009
Posts: 2030
Location: here today but tomorrow...

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 8:15 am Post subject:
I had a huge polytunnel on our smallholding before I didnt have pp but a neighbour complained a year or two after and so the planning guy came out. He said you shouldnt have it without pp I said why not and he said well coz!!! He sent a letter saying I should apply for planning and we just ignored it. It's still there many years later and we have moved as well now.

Nature'sgrafter

Joined: 22 Feb 2012
Posts: 527
Location: Sanday , Orkney

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 10:05 am Post subject:

Sorry bebo but every structure erected that requires planing permission is covered under local building regulations that's why you have to submit plans when you want to build something so that they can check it conforms to the regulations. the main issue is to corner the council into giving exact details as to what they expect from a structure being built that is why the building controll officer comes out it is to check you conform. If your local council has no regulations for temporary structure,s get them to admit it, failing that you may find that permission is only required for structures over a certain foot print. Even then you may find that in your area the only regulation's may be the proximity to a boundary or building and the duration that it will be in that location.
My wife is a member of the chartered institute of building surveyors and got our local council to admit they couldn't insist on planning permission as their reg's remained mute on the point of poly tunnels we now have a 60x18 foot tunnel in our garden covered under permitted development.

Know your enemy https://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/planningandbuilding/pdf/polytunnels.pdf Have a quick read of this

Bebo

Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12590
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 10:34 am Post subject:

Planning consent can be required on things that don't require building regs approval or that building regs don't apply to. For example, if you build a new road you can require planning approval (not always as some things are covered by the Highway Authorities permitted development rights) and that would not fall under the building regs.

Whether polytunnels require consent or not is not straightforward. It depends on its size and siting. If its in your garden or on a farm of more than 5 hectares then it may be covered by permitted development rights. In this case it sounds like it doesn't fall in either of those (6 acres is under the 5ha threshold for agricultural pd rights).

https://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/planningandbuilding/pdf/polytunnels.pdf

The worse that will happen if you don't apply is that you'll get an enforcement notice to take it down. Its not a criminal offense to not apply for planning in this case (it can be if you demolish a listed structure for example). It's only a little one, just put it up without concreting in any basleplates (they don't need it anyway) and you can take it down easily enough if it becomes an issue. Don't forget even if planning do enforce, you can put in a retrospective application and they can't make you take it down while that is being processed.

Bebo

Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12590
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 10:47 am Post subject:
In addition, some things are covered by building regs that don't require planning. Residential extensions and loft conversions for example can fall under permitted development rights (if below a certain size on a building that is already unextended, if you are outside a conservation area and the building is not listed), but would require building regs approval.

foggy

Joined: 21 Feb 2012
Posts: 343
Location: Devon

Posted: Tue Apr 03, 12 12:37 pm Post subject:
do you need planning permission for your knickers?

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