Advice on replacing a building with a log cabin, or similar

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Advice on replacing a building with a log cabin, or similar
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gemini

Joined: 02 Nov 2012
Posts: 69

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 12:19 pm Post subject:
Hi Have you seen a programme on channel 4,re small spaces, there are a load of tips it is on Tuesday 9pm, and he has also a web site, last week it was about modules that cliptogether, as this farmer wanted to diversey.(sorry about spelling) but it is a really good programme,and it is not too complicated Gemini

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46212
Location: yes

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 2:14 pm Post subject:
a chat with planning as to what might be ok is a good idea re cabin vs statics ,a new cabin 30k upwards ,2 used statics maybe 10 k including alterations ,footings ,etc etc iirc a static becomes a building if it is fixed to the floor

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 5:46 pm Post subject:

gemini wrote:

Hi

Have you seen a programme on channel 4,re small spaces, there are a load of tips it is on Tuesday 9pm, and he has also a web site, last week it was about modules that cliptogether, as this farmer wanted to diversey.(sorry about spelling) but it is a really good programme,and it is not too complicated Gemini

We've been watching that series too and it is really interesting, but also very strange how people build things - the pods were such a tight squeeze to get them out of the building & they could have got them out easily by taking some of the boarding above the door off but they decided to turn it around inside the building.

The this week the lady spent a load of money on a chasis that meant her little cabin was portable, then she proceded to build it outside and sheet it down when it rained.

Blacksheep wrote:

Hi I am looking to replace a prefabricated asbestos bungalow, which I don't feel is safely habitable, with possibly a log cabin, double mobile home construction or similar. Aiming to keep costs as low as possible and building as simple as possible but do want to end up with pleasant living space (the current bungalow is within a nice wooded and grassland plot), removal of the existing building could cost up to 40k!
Any advice appreciated of good value sectional/mobile buildings welcome or any to avoid etc.
Hoping the planning should not be too difficult due to the existing dwelling but have absolutely no experience of dealing with planners. Although as the front edge of the bungalow is on the edge of a conservation area there could be some issues, also I have heard of problems with siting log cabins near to trees due to a perceived fire risk, so again any advice or thoughts on these issues welcomed too.
thanks

We built a substantial 6 x 12m cabin for about what dpack said, 30k but using a lot of our own labour and five years ago. 110mm externals and 55mm internals. Speak to planning - it can always be painted grey to resemble asbestos.

onemanband

Joined: 26 Dec 2010
Posts: 1473
Location: NCA90

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 6:49 pm Post subject:
Have you considered doing the demolition yourself ? I'm not familiar with prefab asbestos houses - what type of asbestos or how much, but if it's of any use I am in the process of clearing about 5-6 ton of asbestos corrugated sheeting from my plot - IRO �3000 for a contractor to remove and dispose ... or (as I am doing) IRO �900 for me to remove and put it in a large skip.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 6:52 pm Post subject:
What he said. ^^

Bebo

Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12590
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 7:42 pm Post subject:
Having watched someone die of mesothelioma I wouldn't touch anything asbestos relanted with a bargepole.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 7:46 pm Post subject:

Bebo wrote:

Having watched someone die of mesothelioma I wouldn't touch anything asbestos relanted with a bargepole.

There is asbestos and there is asbestos. The stuff in the concrete boards is relatively safe.

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 12 7:55 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

Bebo wrote:

Having watched someone die of mesothelioma I wouldn't touch anything asbestos relanted with a bargepole.

There is asbestos and there is asbestos. The stuff in the concrete boards is relatively safe.

Especially if you don't cut or break it up and breath in the dust.

Blacksheep

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Posts: 196
Location: Shropshire

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 12 2:19 am Post subject:

Thanks for the replies all.
Yes I have been watching the small spaces series, plenty of interesting ideas there.
The asbestos bungalow is classed as a fixed building rather then temporary structure, it has been in place some 35 to 40years.
The asbestos panels are large floor to ceiling panels, they comprise the outside wall and the inside wall with a sandwich of asbestos insulation. Each individual panel will be quite heavy due to the size, unfortunately I don't think its something that we could manage to tackle ourselves, and once we get help it would need to be professional approved asbestos contractor I would presume. I am not sure what type the asbestos is, and the insulation would probably be more of a concern than the exterior/interior walls of the panels - probably need to get someone in to determine what we type we are dealing with, I assume the builder must have there could be blue asbestos for the indicative price he expected it would be.
Thanks for the indicative prices, again we are probably going to have to employ contractors to install a replacement building, 10k for log cabin statics, with 2 to form a building sounds good very good if it is in decent condition dpack, and would allow some updating internally if this was needed. I have seen one for sale in Ireland, quite a bit more as it is fairly new, this is what made me wonder about the mobile home type that come in 2 halves. Just need to source one a bit nearer... Interesting that it would be considered a static building with be fixed to the floor, that would probably be good as at some point in the future for it should make a super building plot, if the trees don't make it unviable, and I wouldn't want its planning designation to be changed to a mobile home only/temporary building.
We would be looking to let out the cabin/replacement structure so I am currently working with the Council's empty homes officer and waiting to hear back from him, I think he may do some of the liaison with the planning department, and I would like to have his ongoing involvement and help if at all possible, although unlikely that he would remain involved for a large scale rebuild etc. Its helpful to have the information here and I can see if a mobile cabin home is something that could be let through their scheme and assisted with.

Will keep scouring the internet for 2nd hand mobile home cabins preferably, if anyone knows of one for sale please let me know..
cheers

onemanband

Joined: 26 Dec 2010
Posts: 1473
Location: NCA90

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 12 1:01 pm Post subject:

Yes you need to find out what planning will allow before you plan too far.
In what sense is the bungalow uninhabitable ?
If it's 40K to demolish the bungalow, is spending that money on re-cladding, re-roofing, refurbishing, extending etc a better option ?
It may be possible to leave the asbestos in place and build around or clad over it.
Refurbing or extending might also be easier to get thru planning

Blacksheep

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Posts: 196
Location: Shropshire

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 12 9:36 am Post subject:

Hi onemanband, yes we may need to look more into that option, I have just had one local builder out to look at it so far, I made it clear that we were exploring options, including the one you suggest, at the moment, and he is aware of the local planning designations. His opinion was that it was not worthwhile to refurbish the existing dwelling as it may not be structually sound enough, although also he said we could be looking at up to 40k for demolition, so I take your point. I think that the fact that there will still be all that asbestos in the building that is a concern to me, but maybe it shouldn't be if it is properly sealed. Do you think building regs approvals would be needed for any work like this, as if so then maybe I should be checking with them sooner rather than later to see whether or not this type of recladding and lining work would be permitted for the building.
I think I will get together some quotes for demolition, which will help decide on exploring this option further, and as you say should hopefully be easier than getting a replacement building through planning. From the planning aspect I am also wondering whether it would be possible to keep the basic framework in place, just replacing any deteriorated woodwork, and then actually replace the asbestos panels with new (non asbestos!) ones...think I need to talk to another builder, obviously this still entails the cost of asbestos removal.

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 12 10:06 am Post subject:
One of our neighbours couldn't get planning for an extension but it was easily passed for a demolition & rebuild, 10% bigger...

Blacksheep

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Posts: 196
Location: Shropshire

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 12 1:37 pm Post subject:

Hmm interesting Rob, I have just spoken with the planning department and am awaiting confirmation on the whether they consider the building falls within the curtilage of the nearby listed buildings. I think they will want it to, certainly against replacement with a log cabin type construction, likely to want a rebuilt to be similar design to the listed buildings so that is probably out cost-wise. Apparently no problem with refurbishment of the existing building as long as it doesn't look any worse than what is already there, however they did think that the asbestos would probably prevent refurbishment of the existing building.

onemanband

Joined: 26 Dec 2010
Posts: 1473
Location: NCA90

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 12 4:59 pm Post subject:
Sounds like it's a white elephant Is there space to build somewhere else ? i.e don't demolish bungalow - reclassify as an outbuilding or defer cost of demo till later or leave problem for future owners.

Blacksheep

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Posts: 196
Location: Shropshire

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 12 5:27 pm Post subject:

Yes, difficult to know what to do and I probably would be tempted to just leave it for potential new owners sometime in the future but for having to continue paying full Council tax on it.
Had a further discussion with the planners, and it makes little difference whether it is the curtilage of the listed buildings or not, as they will be seeking the same outcome which ever, high quality build and materials, appropriate design etc, if it is not considered to be in the curtilage then there will still be consultation with the conservation officer. If it is not considered to be part of the curtilage that is because they will have determined the building historically (there was a CI barn on the site previously) was more associated with the adjoining woodland area rather than the nearby listed buildings. I would have thought a log cabin would be very appropriate for a building associated with woodland but there you go!
Will try and investigate the asbestos issue a bit further
thanks for all the advice

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