Universal Credit - The End of Small Businesses?

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Universal Credit - The End of Small Businesses?
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jamanda
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Posts: 35080
Location: Devon

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 1:58 pm Post subject:
Where will not for profit organisations fit in?

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 2:03 pm Post subject:

Jamanda wrote:

Where will not for profit organisations fit in?

Aren't they covered by NMW legislation?

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16098

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 2:25 pm Post subject:

I think this is a nasty piece of legislation in its entirity, and is aimed at cutting costs rather than helping people get into reasonably paid work.

The comments made on large companies paying minimum wage rather than a living wage are most important, as is the legislation that allows some of these same large companies to take people for 'work experience' and not give them any training, but get them doing routine work while not paying them.

I am glad that our company has got beyond that stage, but we are trying to get it build up slowly, and for the first few years, if any of us had been on those benefits, we would have had to shut and 2 people be looking for work.

JohnB

Joined: 09 Jul 2005
Posts: 685
Location: Beautiful sunny West Wales!

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 3:55 pm Post subject:

Mistress Rose wrote:

The comments made on large companies paying minimum wage rather than a living wage are most important, as is the legislation that allows some of these same large companies to take people for 'work experience' and not give them any training, but get them doing routine work while not paying them.

Of course if the minimum wage is raised, that makes it eve worse for small businesses struggling with the Universal Credit.

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 4:12 pm Post subject:

JohnB wrote:

Mistress Rose wrote:

Of course if the minimum wage is raised, that makes it eve worse for small businesses struggling with the Universal Credit.

And for large businesses struggling with wages.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15433
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 4:29 pm Post subject:

lettucewoman wrote:

You report your income for that month, less any expenses you have paid out that month. The remainder will be treated as your 'income'. You cannot carry forward any business revenue, even if you have regular, foreseeable expenditure coming up in the future.

Can you not fudge it with some creative accounting?
Separate yourself from the business (or create a separate business on paper) and have one loan money to the other.
Loan repayments are presumably classed as expenses.

JohnB

Joined: 09 Jul 2005
Posts: 685
Location: Beautiful sunny West Wales!

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 5:21 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

Loan repayments are presumably classed as expenses.

Not according to the article: "Repayment of capital or interest on a loan is not a permitted expense".

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15433
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 6:48 pm Post subject:

JohnB wrote:

Hairyloon wrote:

Loan repayments are presumably classed as expenses.

Not according to the article: "Repayment of capital or interest on a loan is not a permitted expense".

Well that is just silly then... never mind, we will just have to be a touch more creative...

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 7:00 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

JohnB wrote:

Hairyloon wrote:

Loan repayments are presumably classed as expenses.

Not according to the article: "Repayment of capital or interest on a loan is not a permitted expense".

Well that is just silly then... never mind, we will just have to be a touch more creative...

Or disruptive. They've barely started the trial yet, never mind set the process in stone. They can only manage with the resources they have, which isn't a lot.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15433
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 7:10 pm Post subject:
It is supposed to come into force on the 29th.

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 7:18 pm Post subject:
Only for new claimants in the 'pathfinder' trial in the North-West. They're starting off with a tiny sample size so that they can administer it manually should the systems fail, as they did at the RPA when they brought in Single Farm Payments ten years ago.

john of wessex

Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 2130

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 7:20 pm Post subject:
The 'pathfinders' also is basically for unemployed single people with no housing costs............

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 7:24 pm Post subject:

john of wessex wrote:

The 'pathfinders' also is basically for unemployed single people with no housing costs............

Exactly. If it works when it goes live in October, it'll be a miracle (and they know it).

jamanda
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Posts: 35080
Location: Devon

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 7:33 pm Post subject:
Who are "they"?

Rob R

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 31902
Location: York

Posted: Sat Apr 13, 13 7:35 pm Post subject:
The people who are faced with the task of implementing it, civil servants & ministers.

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