Solar generator / UPS / backup thingamy

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Solar generator / UPS / backup thingamy
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Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Sun Mar 22, 15 6:05 pm Post subject: Solar generator / UPS / backup thingamy

We've been considering a couple of UPS devices for various reasons. What's put me off is the cost for good quality ones and their limitations. I've also been considering some form of solar set-up, at least what needs to be done to a house in preparation for the addition of one.

Today we bumped into someone selling a system that makes use of a grid tied solar array and stores some of the power in a battery for later use. The aim is to use more of your power but I noted it'll also perform a whole-house UPS function and would reduce/remove the need for a fossil fueled back-up generator. As you're grid tied the batteries can be topped up in the middle of winter from the grid so they'll be ready if you get a long power cut.

Anyway, here's the system they were selling: https://www.victronenergy.com/inverters-chargers/ecomulti . It's not cheap (especially once batts are factored in) but has anyone heard of such systems? Any recommendations or alternatives?

What I'm interested at the moment is seeing what options are out there and what I might need to do if I renovated a house. For example, it was suggested to have two consumer units - one for grid only and one for your grid-tied solar set-up.

vegplot

Joined: 19 Apr 2007
Posts: 21301
Location: Bethesda, Gwynedd

Posted: Sun Mar 22, 15 6:21 pm Post subject:
It looks interesting although I would expect it to have an auto grid disconnect wired to allow the use of a single consumer unit. I've not looked at the information data sheet so it may well have.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Sun Mar 22, 15 6:31 pm Post subject:
You have to have an auto disconnect from the grid, else if there is a power cut, then you are still keeping your section live. Bad news for the engineer who wants to fix it.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Sun Mar 22, 15 6:39 pm Post subject:

vegplot wrote:

It looks interesting although I would expect it to have an auto grid disconnect wired to allow the use of a single consumer unit. I've not looked at the information data sheet so it may well have.

It does have a disconnect I believe, the dual consumer unit would be more for my benefit. I.e. wire up equipment we need to one linked to the Ecomulti (freezer, lights, PC) and other equipment to the other (washing machine etc).

Now that may well not be necessary but worth thinking about.

vegplot

Joined: 19 Apr 2007
Posts: 21301
Location: Bethesda, Gwynedd

Posted: Sun Mar 22, 15 6:49 pm Post subject:
This might be of interest in our new build.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Fri May 01, 15 7:03 am Post subject:

Interesting, if it makes it over here. https://www.teslamotors.com/powerwall

Quote:

Technology
Wall mounted, rechargeable lithium ion battery with liquid thermal control.
Models
10 kWh $3,500 For backup applications 7 kWh $3,000 For daily cycle applications
Warranty
Ten year warranty with an optional ten year extension.
Efficiency
92% round-trip DC efficiency
Power
2.0 kW continuous, 3.3 kW peak
Voltage
350 � 450 volts
Current
5 amp nominal, 8.5 amp peak output

RichardW

Joined: 24 Aug 2006
Posts: 8443
Location: Llyn Peninsular North Wales

Posted: Fri May 01, 15 7:00 pm Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Interesting, if it makes it over here. https://www.teslamotors.com/powerwall

Quote:

So at best thats 11p per kWh if you use all 7kWh per day every day for 10 years with no other costs due to servicing or repairs.

I dont think I want to buy my next 10 years worth of elec in one go.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Fri May 01, 15 7:02 pm Post subject:
It's new technology. It's going to be expensive, and designed for industry and early adopters. Relax. You're not a target audience.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Fri May 01, 15 8:37 pm Post subject:

RichardW wrote:

I dont think I want to buy my next 10 years worth of elec in one go.

The numbers don't seem to make sense just to use cheap night time leccy, no. However, I was thinking it would be more useful in areas where the power isn't that reliable.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Fri May 01, 15 8:39 pm Post subject:

Nick wrote:

It's new technology. It's going to be expensive, and designed for industry and early adopters. Relax. You're not a target audience.

I'm not sure about that. The basic idea has been available for a few years now and looking at the details from Tesla they're building a new factory ready for 2020, so I can't see this is going to be that viable for a few more years.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Fri May 01, 15 9:11 pm Post subject:
That's how technologies emerge.

RichardW

Joined: 24 Aug 2006
Posts: 8443
Location: Llyn Peninsular North Wales

Posted: Sat May 02, 15 7:12 am Post subject:
If you want to use all your locally made elec on site then get an Emma or similar & turn it into hot water. Unreliable power is a different matter. Just how unreliable? A small cheap petrol genny might be a better solution.

Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Sat May 02, 15 7:24 am Post subject:

Nick wrote:

That's how technologies emerge.

Some faster than others. The basic idea and some products has been around for so long I would expect a better offering. I note in some of the reports they question whether a better technology will come to market before the Tesla batteries get established.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Sat May 02, 15 7:30 am Post subject:

RichardW wrote:

If you want to use all your locally made elec on site then get an Emma or similar & turn it into hot water.

Unreliable power is a different matter.

Just how unreliable?

A small cheap petrol genny might be a better solution.

Yes, I'm currently looking at the Honda 20i.

We get lots of small power cuts, sometimes only for a few seconds but often for an hour. However, if we move somewhere more remote I expect we could have to put up with over 8 hours without power and possibly longer. That would be rare but when working from home and keeping a couple of full freezers we need something to provide power.

I did look at a smaller battery powered gennie but the run time was just too short.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Sat May 02, 15 7:54 am Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Nick wrote:

That's how technologies emerge.

Oh, very possibly. To get where we want to get, there will be blind alleys and competing solutions.

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