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tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45674
Location: Essex

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 10:54 am Post subject:
That's why i didn't approach you directly, it needs to be someone that's working for someone else, or does it as a hobby thing really. A collaborative effort with someone else maybe? mrutty, neilk, etc....

mrsnesbitt

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 1576

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 10:55 am Post subject:
As you know I am in the process of getting a website done for my business.from the other side of the fence, not as a web head, more of an air head I would be willing to share my website development. I know I get help from the webheads, in particular mrutty, who I do appreciate despite the jibes I make at his spelling!!

mrutty

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 1578

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 8:15 pm Post subject:
and my rates are such good value

mrutty

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 1578

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 8:29 pm Post subject:

Sorry didn't read all of the thread.

I really only use Frontpage for quick deployments, vi for unix, notepad for my stuff and hotmetal pro when I'm stuck.

Are you looking for the sort of site develop tools I tried to help Legion out with ie web hosting with online tools you can access anywhere in the world or two3five/alexwatersracing or jema's trading pages?

The reason for the question is that each has it's own pros and cons. My core sites are start ups that anyone could support after the initial build so I could write on for Mrs N that she could go onwards and support with Frontpage without have to have too much knowledge.

Also you need to look at the hosting service.I always try to use Pipex or BT for companies. In 15 odd years I've never had an issue with Pipex. BT is good if the business uses the BT business account service (which is very good) and the business then only has one company to chase for problems.

Jema on the other hand uses different companies because they meet his needs.

Legion (when she gets somewhere near back to normal) was looking for quick and easy deployment and development all with online tools.

The hardest part as Mrs N will confirm is trying to tease out what the customer really wants or needs. I'm working on a neighbours website that has now turned into a networking the admin office, sorting out ADSL, email services (using redirects as no Exchange or SMTP servers) and finally I might get to a website. Mrs N is very understanding when she gets a short blunt email of 'not now I'm busy' as I get more and more stressed with requirements slipage

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45674
Location: Essex

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 9:51 pm Post subject:
I think just an explanation of the different types of sites, what's html, what's flash, how do you make it work with email, ecommerce etc

dougal

Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 7184
Location: South Kent

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 10:32 pm Post subject:

Got to agree with mrutty that the major problem is goalposts developing redshift when working with a client who is "learning"... (whatever the project)

But its really quite straightforward to build and link *simple* pages. Even to post pdf's of a carefully laid out brochure, or whatever, for download.
Many WP packages have a "save as HTML" option...
(As a Mac-person, I'm ruling myself out of explaining "how" to pc-people!)

Creation of a *very* simple website IS *very* simple...
Inevitably, you're going to want to enhance it with better graphics, pretty graphical buttons that show when the user rolls over them, clickable imagemaps, flash animations, pages built 'on the fly' from a live database - and maybe even online financial transactions (but that is a LONG way from the simplest site).

However, I'd love to see a cogent explanation of "hosting" packages - domain hosting, webspace hosting - or even, if you have a 24/7 connection, whether running your own server (a used Cobalt Qube2 is about �100 on eBay, or a new Mac mini is �339 inc vat, full unix OS, Apache webserver, one-click firewall, etc - it draws less than 40w and is TINY) makes any sense (and what else is needed - a secondary DNS server?)
And then there's search engine lore...

mrsnesbitt

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 1576

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 11:12 pm Post subject:
I suddenly realise I should not be here, in this forum!

mrutty

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 1578

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 11:16 pm Post subject:

mrsnesbitt wrote:

I suddenly realise I should not be here, in this forum!

Oh yes you should to stop me going on about the differnces about http 1 and 1.1 and the guidelines given in the RFC that most companies ignore.

See one whole sentance that might mean something to one other person on this site

alison
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 12918
Location: North Devon

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 11:17 pm Post subject:

mrutty wrote:

mrsnesbitt wrote:

I suddenly realise I should not be here, in this forum!

And to help with your spelling!!

mrutty

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 1578

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 11:21 pm Post subject:
well that goes without saying

mrsnesbitt

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 1576

Posted: Fri Jan 28, 05 11:30 pm Post subject:

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45674
Location: Essex

Posted: Sat Jan 29, 05 11:59 am Post subject:
Come on guys between you (Jema, dougal, mrutty) you shoild be able you throw together a duffers guide to setting up their first webite

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28237
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sat Jan 29, 05 12:11 pm Post subject:

For me one of the major issues is the upgrade path. It can be all very well thinking that someone who wants to simply get on the web, just needs a few nicely created html pages, and maybe that is all tehy do need for now.

But I have seen some of the "reasonable" rates,, then charged if someone simply wants a few things changed

It is not that the rates are a rip off, they are not, but the problem with static html pages is that they are just that, static unless changed by someone with some knowledge.

If the user then wants to go beyond a few pages, perhaps adding content of their own, they are then in a bit of a dead end.

As such I think for most people who may well expand what they do on the web, it makes sense to get a full fledged hosting package, which is afterall only �6 a month, and something like Mambo, that after the initial setup, is hopefully something they can be taught to manage themselves.

You will pay a bit more upfront for this, though possible not very much more, as modifying a mambo template to look good for someone is little different to doing an initial html page layout.

jema

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45674
Location: Essex

Posted: Sat Jan 29, 05 12:15 pm Post subject:
I'd agree about Mambo, I'm a total novice but have found it quite straightforward to work with

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28237
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sat Jan 29, 05 12:20 pm Post subject:

tahir wrote:

I'd agree about Mambo, I'm a total novice but have found it quite straightforward to work with

My thing is that ethically I prefer solutions that enpower people. I do not like the idea that when someone wants to change a dot to a comma on the site, they have to phone up and be told "that will be �20 guv".
However on the slight negative side, a mambo site would require a yearly maintenance charge.

jema

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