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Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Thu Feb 11, 10 12:01 pm Post subject:
I wonder how expensive it would be if we changed our attitudes and used what we already have? There's loads of fresh water places that could provide some edible fish rather than just sport. I bet you could produce more kg of fish that the total amount of salmon.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46238
Location: yes

Posted: Thu Feb 11, 10 12:10 pm Post subject:
fried sand eels anyone ? better toasted the carp ponds of the middle ages worked on a basic feed of spent barley from the brewing and clean streams to give good water but fish was a premium product to make it economic soyalent green anyone?

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Thu Feb 11, 10 1:20 pm Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

I wonder how expensive it would be if we changed our attitudes and used what we already have? There's loads of fresh water places that could provide some edible fish rather than just sport. I bet you could produce more kg of fish that the total amount of salmon.

Just managing the canals and waterways properly would be a very good start.

mihto

Joined: 03 Feb 2008
Posts: 3273
Location: West coast of Norway

Posted: Thu Feb 11, 10 5:29 pm Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

In January 2010 Norway exported salmon with approximate value of � 130.000.000.

That is an enormous amount of fish.

We have rivers and lakes in a number you cannot believe. In my childhood all freshwater fish was very expensive. I had my first taste of fresh salmon at the tender age of 25. All fish were wild at the time.

Farming fish is a gigantic industry. There is no way fish can be farmed to this extent without substantial feeding. Until today no vegetarian source of protein has been found.

I'm sure edible fish can be provided from some lakes to support a few families. There is no way any "home industry" can cover the income our fish farmers earn these days.

This is big capital, second in our economy to oil only.

cab

Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

Posted: Thu Feb 11, 10 5:46 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

Depressingly, I just cannot be bothered to argue.
Frankly, it does not matter how expensive it is. Money is all imaginary anyway.

Thats easy to say, but harder to make work. When it comes down to it farming is an industry, aquaculture no less, and unless its profitable (or subsidised) it can't happen.

cab

Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

Posted: Thu Feb 11, 10 5:47 pm Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Properly managed you certainly produce fish that way, but you have to be careful when you start managing whats almost a wild space for harvest. Sounds feasibl though.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Thu Feb 11, 10 5:58 pm Post subject:

mihto wrote:

I'm sure edible fish can be provided from some lakes to support a few families. There is no way any "home industry" can cover the income our fish farmers earn these days.

Well I was talking about the UK and still think we could produce a reasonable amount of fresh water fish to eat from our reservoirs, lakes, river canals and our rather surprising number of recreational fishing ponds. Even if we couldn't, I bet we could provide a reasonable contribution to what we need rather than what we want.

Bodger

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 13524

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 8:42 am Post subject:
I would imagine that there very few of us on the forum who've eaten freshwater fish other than salmon and trout. I've eaten pike and perch quite a few times and like them. I once read about the gudgeon fishing parties in the 1800s and for my pains, have tried eating this rather small fish. They're alright if you don't mind fish with your bones.

cab

Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 11:16 am Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

If you're enriching freshwater habitats to increase productivity and taking stuff out, you risk eutrophication, and you also risk doing harm to the biodiversity of those habitats. I'm not saying it can't be done, but you've got to be cautious.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46238
Location: yes

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 11:42 am Post subject:
i recon a mile of good river would support a small family for protien or half a mile of coast any greater stocking density of peeps needs agri/aquaculture

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 12:42 pm Post subject:

cab wrote:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Good job I didn't say that or anything like that then.

cab

Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 3:35 pm Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Good job I didn't say that or anything like that then.

If you weren't saying anything like that then you're talking about just taking fish from those sources, which does mean changing the habitat and it does mean affecting biodiversity. Again, I'm not saying it can't or shouldn't be done, just that to do so requires great caution.

You can't have an unfed system where we increase how much we take out of it without having an impact, and you can't feed without having an impact. Either way you do it requires caution.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 3:53 pm Post subject:
So do it cautiously. What's the problem?

cab

Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 4:25 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

So do it cautiously.
What's the problem?

You'd think it'd be that simple. Never is though. If it were, mankind wouldn't cause half of the environmental problems it does

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Fri Feb 12, 10 4:50 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

So do it cautiously.
What's the problem?

Exactly. And it's not as if things like reservoirs haven't had any impact on our landscape.

If people ate fish from our fresh waters it wouldn't surprise me if it was better for our wildlife with people taking more care. A bit like wildfowling or game shooting.

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