Domestic wells and dowsing

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Domestic wells and dowsing
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Foghorn

Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Posts: 49
Location: Barcombe, E Sussex

Posted: Mon Apr 17, 06 10:50 pm Post subject: Domestic wells and dowsing

Two unconnected enquiries, but I would be very grateful if anyone can provide me with any useful sources of information on

(1) dometic wells - we've just opened up a well in our garden, and I would like to know how to test the water, and generally find out about all things well-related. Are there any useful sites out there? Does anyone else have any experience of wells?

(2) have just tried a spot of dowsing for the first time, and would also be keen to hear about any useful resources or other people's experiences.

Thanks

jema
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28239
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 12:25 am Post subject:
dowsing is totally proven not to work!

sally_in_wales
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Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 20809
Location: sunny wales

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 5:28 am Post subject:

jema wrote:

dowsing is totally proven not to work!

But a lot of fun can be had wandering round the garden with two bent coat hangers trying various 'scientific experiments' to work that out

I used to while away many an hour as a kid attempting to dowse for lost toys (never found them) but it kept me out from underfoot.

I have seen some fairly convincing dowsers at work over the years who get pretty good results, but as Jema says, in tightly controlled tests it doesnt seem to hold up, which is a pity. I suppose in the cases of the water dowsers who have a good success rate they must be subconciously spotting lots of other little bits of evidence for water and translating all that into the dip of the wand, but it just doesnt seem to hold up under more controlled conditions. Wish it did work properly though

jema
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28239
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 6:48 am Post subject:

sally_in_wales wrote:

I suppose in the cases of the water dowsers who have a good success rate they must be subconciously spotting lots of other little bits of evidence for water and translating all that into the dip of the wand, but it just doesnt seem to hold up under more controlled conditions. Wish it did work properly though

I have not heard of tests done in these what you might call "uncontrolled" conditions, but it does make a certian amount of sense that a dowser would be successful, in that water in the naturual environment does not exist in sealed containers and therefore is both effecting things and effected by things.

Bugs

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 10744

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 6:57 am Post subject:
I've always fancied having a go at dowsing - can't see it doing anyone any harm (except I'll probably fall over on the stick).

jema
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28239
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 7:10 am Post subject:
I made some dowsing rods myself once I had an inkling at the time that there might actually be something in it. The "net" as a research tool is a bit of a sledgehammer at times. All of a sudden you can pick a subject and examine its underbelly. Reminds me of the philosophers in the Hitch Hikers Guide with their strike demand for strictly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty

Lisa

Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 248
Location: Cheshire

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 8:21 am Post subject:
I know it's been proved not to work. But, but but...I was on a dig a few years back and we used dowsing rods to locate old walls. I was Ms Cynical (I am a scientist) but had a go with my eyes shut and They Moved! At exactly the correct point. I have no idea.

Lozzie

Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 2595

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 8:23 am Post subject:
I can never understand how it is that things, having been scientifically proven not to work, somehow continue to work.

alison
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Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 12918
Location: North Devon

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 8:26 am Post subject:
we found our water pipes here with dousing, although I did it and my OH couldn't get a twitch at all. We had no idea where they were, suffice to say they were between 2 points, and we were digging up tarmac to prove I was right.

cab

Joined: 01 Nov 2004
Posts: 32429

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 9:01 am Post subject:

Lozzie wrote:

I can never understand how it is that things, having been scientifically proven not to work, somehow continue to work.

The thing about dowsing is that your success rate is pretty high if you just pick lower ground and places where slopes change. Such changes in topography usually reflect a change underground. And its amazing watching a dowser, they'll pick out such places time and time again, and if one of them turns out to be a water source they'll claim success (despite the three earlier drillings that came back cry). Give me a good A-level geography student and I'll teach them to spot such changes in topology within an hour, and get a similar success rate to that of a doswer.

The common way of testing, usually accepted by dowsers as an easy one to pass, is to get six upturned bins and put a cup of water under one of them. Time and time again dowsers enthusiastically try to demonstrate that their system works better than pure chance, and time and time again they fail. Invariably, after doing it, they start finding reasons why it didn't work.

Thing that I find hardest here is that dowsers always seem to be really sincere, interesting people. Really good eggs, at least in my experience. So its such a shame that what they do doesn't really work any better than chance and topology

It isn't, of course, absolutely proven that it doesn't work (such absolutes are not what science is about, anyone who asks science for such absolutes needs a glass of perspective and tonic, and perhaps a lie down). It has merely been proven to the point where one can't make a ralistic case in favour of dowsing.

So for me, its filed away as one of those things I'd really love to believe, but don't.

gil
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Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 18415

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 10:51 am Post subject: Re: Domestic wells and dowsing

Foghorn wrote:

(1) dometic wells - we've just opened up a well in our garden, and I would like to know how to test the water, and generally find out about all things well-related. Are there any useful sites out there? Does anyone else have any experience of wells ?

Re testing water : wonder if you could get info from the English equivalent of SEPA (Scottish Environmental Protection Agency). Also your local water board.

Behemoth - any suggestions ?
(I only know [a bit] about springs as off-mains water sources)

Foghorn

Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Posts: 49
Location: Barcombe, E Sussex

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 11:38 am Post subject:

Thanks for the replies folks - if anyone has anything on wells, I'd greatly appreciate a steer.

On the dowsing side, I tried it for the first time at the weekend, and it was fascinating. I had an experienced dowser as a guide, and was initially sceptical. I tried dowsing for water, and for energy from megalithic stones (Avebury) as well as energy lines. The rods turned for me at exactly the right point, almost every time I did it, sometimes when I knew where the point of interference was, sometimes when I had no idea. I've since tried it in the garden, and I seem to be picking out moving water quite effectively.

I'm fairly confident that I wasn't deceiving myself, knowingly or otherwise. The experienced dowser did tell me that you have to know what you want to find, and be able to visualise it. If you just run around with dowsing rods, you'll get some hits, but you won't know why.

From what I can see, I don't think dowsing has been properly evaluated, because I think there is a fundmanetal lack of understanding about how it works - I don't think dowsers even know how it works. So blind trials, etc. are not necessarily going to be conclusive, because I think dowsing relies on some level of awareness of the wider environment.

And it seems to be water courses (moving water) as opposed to static water that makes the greatest impact, and this is certainly what I found.

It's easy to dismiss dowsing, particularly as it seems to be associated with a lot of fairly ethereal new age stuff, but it's been around for a long time, and there is something inherently logical about a sensitive device (human + indicating rods) being able to respond to changes in the electromagnetic spectrum, even quite small ones. I know that's not the full story, but keeping an open mind isn't such a great hardship, particularly when "hard science" so routinely fails to deliver.

gil
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Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 18415

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 11:44 am Post subject:
Here, in an ordinary, practical-minded farming community, dowsing is seen as a perfectly normal thing to do or discuss. Some folk have the knack, others don't; simple as that.

gingerwelly

Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 419
Location: Wales ...in cardiff at the mo but from mid wales

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 11:56 am Post subject: Re: Domestic wells and dowsing

gil wrote:

Foghorn wrote:

we have our own well at home ..by law we have to have it tested ..the local water company come and test it every few years for free.

Foghorn

Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Posts: 49
Location: Barcombe, E Sussex

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 06 12:17 pm Post subject:
Cheers GW - do they just come and test it and tell you whether it's drinkable? Are there any negative consequences to this, e.g. do they tell you what you can and can't do with your well?

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